Sam Abuelsamid 0:00 Coming up on episode 268 wheel bearings who got the Ford Expedition Timberline the Bronco Raptor, the Honda HRV Land Rover Defender trophy, the reveal the Polestar 3, Sony and Honda are setting up shop in Ohio Toyota ditches Amazon and an update from Electrify America. All that and more coming up next. Hey, everybody, we really appreciate it. If you could help us out by taking a couple of minutes to do a quick survey to tell us a little bit about who's listening to the show and what their interests are. You can do that at survey dot wheel bearings dot media, and we really appreciate it. Thanks. This is episode 268 of wheel bearings. I'm Sam Abuelsamid from guidehouse insights Nicole Wakelin 0:52 and I am Nicole Wakelin from the FAST Women podcast. Roberto Baldwin 0:55 And I'm Roberto Baldwin from Nikkei the Nikkei. Nikkei Yeah. Sam Abuelsamid 1:03 So are you writing in Japanese now? Roberto Baldwin 1:06 So they take my words, and then they make them Japanese. Sam Abuelsamid 1:11 They don't just want to Google Translate. Roberto Baldwin 1:14 knows they have some I'm sure they have people on staff who speak both languages native human translate, and then they translate them into Japanese so they're my first article went up. That's kind of Oh, yeah. Yeah, no, it's it's it's cool. But also the fact that I don't know how to say it is. Nicole Wakelin 1:33 Pretty much just call Sam Sam who I work for him. I work for please tell me Sam Sam Abuelsamid 1:42 All right. So what have you been driving this week Mr. Baldwin? Roberto Baldwin 1:52 I've been driving the Bronco rips floor. No, no way. Bronco rafters I don't know how to spell and pronounce anything. No Bronco raptor which I have not taken it off road. So it's just completely ridiculous. Are you just driving around way higher and everyone just burning through gas every time I started up it's like a whole Brontosaurus just gets saturated. I just I just I just Yeah, I just destroyed the oil output of an entire Brontosaurus Yeah, it's Unknown Speaker 2:26 I mean Roberto Baldwin 2:28 I feel like they mean I have all the Raptors To me this is the one that makes the most sense because most sense or least sense that makes the most sense. Okay, because I still follow the Bronco raptor out of all the Raptors saying that any of the Nicole Wakelin 2:45 Broncos my brain went out of all the Broncos and really that's when he makes a bet okay I don't know the round I just now I'm with you Roberto Baldwin 2:51 all the Raptors because the Raptors are just ridiculous. I still believe you know if you have a truck you should be hauling stuff not trying to I don't know. So the Bronco rafter is of all the rafters the least the one that makes most sense but it's still all look the entire ratchet lineup the TRS all this like super truck. It's all ridiculous and insane. And it's really mostly just dudes flexing and pretty much if you bought the Bronco raptor and you live out in the desert and your Bronco wrapped during all the time, good. That's the year the person I'm like good for you. You You're you're you're you're living your best life. You bought a Bronco raptor and you just want to hang out in the parking lot fine. I mean, I don't want to be judgy but come on. No. Sam Abuelsamid 3:39 Let's judge Roberto Baldwin 3:43 there are tons of really nice off road parks in America you should be out there driving dangerously. Sam Abuelsamid 3:51 But but make sure you get a winch and some mud terrain tires Yes. Roberto Baldwin 3:56 through mud be sure to get my train tires. That's Nicole Wakelin 3:58 it. I've heard sources. Yeah. Roberto Baldwin 4:02 The right tool for the job. That's what you Sam Abuelsamid 4:05 absolutely Roberto Baldwin 4:08 yeah, I've been driving around everyone who gets in it is like what is this? What's going on? Like, why is this car so hard to get into? Like, Oh, you gotta like do this and pull yourself in and they're like, it's just it's exercising and you get some exercise going. It's just it's a weird height for tall people to get in. It's like not really tall but it's not shorter for you just hop in. So like getting in is like this weird it yeah, there's a weird Yeah, if you're like I think if you're six foot or taller, it's a very weird vehicle to get into because it's not Yeah. And a lot of sort of trucks are kind of like that where if you're shorter than that, and it's been lifted, you're like, oh, I can just grab and pull myself up. You're kind of pulling yourself sideways. It's a weird Yeah, I thought it was just me but other tall people have gotten in the car and be like, this is just kind of annoying to get into. Like if you're in shorter, like Yeah, yeah, if I was shorter, I'll make a lot more sense that if I were taller I would just like you know slide in. So for tall people, I guess remember that? Overall I like to I don't understand why there's carpet in it at all. Sam Abuelsamid 5:12 That's a very good point. Yeah, that Nicole Wakelin 5:14 is actually a very good point. It should be like the old Honda Element that just had the washed out flooring. Sam Abuelsamid 5:18 Well does at least have like the deep well rubber mats Yes. Okay has Roberto Baldwin 5:23 a deep well, rubber mats, which I'm a huge fan of, but at the same time, like why even bother don't put carpet yet? Like everything in the car is just like hey, what's how's it out? And you're like, oh, wait, except for the carpet. It's gonna get Sam Abuelsamid 5:35 it does have drain plugs underneath the carpet. Yeah, so you can't hose it out. Roberto Baldwin 5:39 Can you just pull them out? I don't know. I I know. Sam Abuelsamid 5:43 Last week after we recorded last weekend went out to try and clean up the Raptor. I was driving that I got stuck in the mud. And you know the mats, I was able to just close those down but you know trying to try to get the mud and stuff off the carpet was a real pain in the neck. Yeah, don't Roberto Baldwin 6:01 don't put carpet in something like this. That's just that's insane. Sam Abuelsamid 6:05 Unless of course you're just going to be a poser. Yeah. Nicole Wakelin 6:10 What do you think the ratio is guys who people shouldn't say guys humans who purchased the vehicle and actually use it versus humans who are like look at my vehicle. I've never really used Roberto Baldwin 6:20 percentages. I you know what, I wish it wasn't this low. But I'm thinking like maybe 25% Maybe Yeah, off road on a on a on a let's say every two or three months. Every two or three months. They go off roading a little bit they do some stuff. I mean, maybe they go camping, maybe you know they they do some proper off roading. Everyone else I would say maybe once every six months, maybe once a year, maybe just once or twice ever, ever, ever. Which is which is sort of disappointing because the whole vehicles made for going you know, bonkers off road. Nicole Wakelin 6:54 I agree. I think most people aren't going to use it but really like if you do get this like even if you're not a bonkers person become that person. Yeah. Roberto Baldwin 7:04 Take a class taking class. They'll teach you how to do it. There's like there's there's plenty of classes. It looks cool. I got the orange one with like the black and red like Stripe things on it. So lately can't You can't miss it. I was pulling up to pick up someone from Bard. I'm like, I hope you don't. I hope you can find me. Nicole Wakelin 7:22 Really hard to spot out here. Roberto Baldwin 7:25 I mean, there is everything. This excites the 12 year old inside of me everything about it just like yeah, this is awesome. This is great. This is cool. I wish I still lived in to catch up with this will not live there. I wish I was there driving this around because it'd be perfect for driving around all the dirt roads and hills attached be the Bay Area. There's also one but you gotta go like two hours away because you know, people live far more people live here. And they've they've paved the roads here. Sam Abuelsamid 7:57 I bet you if if Mike Levine at Ford gets one of these. And I suspect that he probably will at some point in the not too distant future probably when it's time to replace his current Ranger. That he he will take this thing out every weekend. Because that's what he does Roberto Baldwin 8:13 every day. Yeah, if you might, if you don't follow Mike Levine on Twitter. He's Ford comps. And I have anyone I mean, he's four times so of course he's going to be very yeah who afford what is his limit, but he is living he is living his message. That's the thing. He's not like this guy. Nicole Wakelin 8:31 He's talking about how offered worthy all this stuff is and how you can go drive anywhere in it as he sits behind his desk and ever goes anywhere. Like the man is out there all the time. So when he's like, look at what I did, you're like, wow, okay, you did that in that vehicle. You did it. You're out. Roberto Baldwin 8:45 I don't think he has a home. I think he's attending him and his family. And they just like roll around in the desert. And they just they're just living like nomads and he does all his work and he's got a satellite phone. Satellite Wi Fi he's got Starlink Nicole Wakelin 9:02 that's totally that's all the connects us to Mike Roberto Baldwin 9:05 it's all connected system like a star like so yeah, no Bronco Raptor. I mean, it's it's it's incredibly ridiculous. But it's ridiculous. It's done in a it's the execution is very smart. I really liked back there. There's all a whole lot of buttons, like all the buttons you need, like all the things that like sort of complain about what like, why is the camera system behind the behind the screen? Why is this behind the screen? Why is this in the display? Why is this? All of that is a button and it's all buttons like once you figure out where they are like, Oh, this can't this is where the camera is. I always know where the camera is now. Sam Abuelsamid 9:43 I always know and they're all They're all rubber coated and sealed. Yeah, you know, so the sweat the mechanic the actual switches are behind a rubber cover. So that when you do hose it out, you're not going to get water in all those places where you don't actually want water to get to and and and get to the buttons, you know, there's even the auxilary switch, I think there's like six auxilary switches up above the mirror. So that you know if you're, if you're putting on extra lights or, or your winch, for example, which you should definitely get if you're going to go mudding once again, Roberto Baldwin 10:15 a winch, or one of them is like an SOS that could get a friend and Winch you out of out of a mud hole. Sam Abuelsamid 10:20 Yeah, so it is. So you can you can wire all so you don't have to hook up extra switches, you know, they're the buttons are all printed, the switches are all pre wired. And then you can just tie into those wires. So that you've, you've got all that stuff there. See, it takes us a lot less effort to install that stuff. Roberto Baldwin 10:44 Yes, yes. No, they really set it up really nice. I liked it. The steering wheel buttons are also behind rubber. So you know, I've been a wrangler once when it started raining in Hawaii. And I was like, You know what, I'm gonna bother put the hell Nicole Wakelin 11:02 whenever I bring it Roberto Baldwin 11:03 exactly. Which is why you shouldn't have carpet in the carpet like this. Yeah, it gets horrible gas mileage. Just no, I'm shocked. Shocked. Horrible, horrible gas mileage was driving around. I think I'm getting like 13 point. What was it? Six? MPG? Actually, that's Nicole Wakelin 11:21 better than what I thought you were gonna say. Sam Abuelsamid 11:23 I got 15 last week. Roberto Baldwin 11:24 Yeah, so combined. Yeah. So yeah, it's not. It's also not cheap. A lot of people come up to me like, well, how much is this? And like, a lot? No, you know, according to them and running they sent me over it starts at 60,500 which means you're never gonna you're not gonna get never getting that. That and that. And that cost. It's in the code orange. That's the color I got. Which is cool. I really liked it, Orange. But you know, what did they throw? They start with $3,000 leather trim suede seats in there. No. Nicole Wakelin 11:57 No, because you're gonna ruin this even survives the suede part. Sam Abuelsamid 12:01 You want flannel? Yeah, you Roberto Baldwin 12:03 just Yeah. Then interior carbon fiber pack now. Nicole Wakelin 12:08 There's the one of the one of the trims of the normal ish Brunker Brunker. Bronco has been Brunker has marine grade vinyl in it to like, I can't read. There's one and I'm like, that's the one I want. Sam Abuelsamid 12:21 Like, the bass one. Nicole Wakelin 12:23 Is it this one? Sam Abuelsamid 12:24 I think you can get the bass one with that marine grade vinyl. I went that maybe it maybe it comes with like if you get the bass one with the Sasquatch package. Yeah, I Nicole Wakelin 12:32 can't remember the details on it. But I remember seeing it and thinking it actually looks cool. It doesn't look horrible. And I'm like, marine grade. That's what I want. Yeah, Roberto Baldwin 12:41 exactly. And then they come up with it. There's a code orange seatbelt, that's 400 bucks, and just get to that. Oh my god $400. But they didn't have the key. They have that keyless entry keypad which is 110 bucks. I feel like that's the best 110 bucks you can spend, especially if you're someone who likes to swim. You know, our surf or sale or whatever. And you don't want to get your electronics wet. Or if you're a surfer or swimmer. You don't have anywhere to put that key and you can take it apart and do that whole thing. Or you can just use the keypad. Total price for the for the Bronco Raptor, they dropped off my house at $1,085 which is so much money. It's so and I looked at Sam Abuelsamid 13:30 if you if you can find one, the dealer is probably going to charge you anywhere from 20 to 40,000 to horse markup on top of that. Roberto Baldwin 13:40 Yeah, it's no it's, it's it's I don't know, I feel like in at some point, hopefully in the future people will be able to buy these at which the regular MSRP of 69 $68 You know, $70,000 but also, you know, the EV powertrain on the F 150 lightning is so great. It's really good. And I look forward to seeing that on this. Maybe not the Raptor because again, but Nicole Wakelin 14:12 he's like it's a rector don't Sam Abuelsamid 14:15 vary from those types. Roberto Baldwin 14:18 These are like this. These are like the Lamborghinis for off for people who want to at least present themselves as offroaders you know? Well, Lamborghini people don't go to you know, a majority of them. They drive them around town. They go to the club. It's very much a show off vehicle even though those Lamborghinis are, you know, for the most part, they're, they're wonderful vehicles. They're great on tracks. They're fun to drive. But you know, I'm at the club lifted up and it's Instagram mobiel yes is like sort of an instrument Graham would feel. So there, rocker after you buy the Raptor. I will chase you down unless I find out you're going to go if I can. follow you in your router for an entire month in my bi Z. I'm very disappointed. Nicole Wakelin 15:05 And you should as we should be, we should all be disappointed. She gets a license plate. we shame them. Roberto Baldwin 15:12 Anyway, no Bronco wrapper. Fun I get I haven't had a chance to take it off road. I took the rigor at rep. Bronco. Offroad It was great. I'm sure this is great term, or at least faster for reasons that are unknown to me. But yeah, there you go. Bronco Raptor. All right. Nicole Wakelin 15:31 Now I am ready now. Okay. I have not been calling it the herb. It's the Honda HRV and I've been referring it to the herb all week. So if the Honda herb, which the HRV is all new this year, and it actually it is a vastly improved vehicle. Let's start this is like not the top of the Honda lineup. This is your like base level crossover. I just graduated college I don't have a lot of money in the bank. I need a vehicle kind of thing. This is not your I have arrived vehicle that said, it is really so much better than it was before. Like I remember the old HRV I had to drive it, oddly enough all the way to Vermont, which I did again with this one, which I'll talk about later. But I drove to Vermont and driving that a long distance. It was loud. It was underpowered, it was not fun to drive. It felt every bit like it was an entry level across it felt cheap. Oh my gosh, it was terrible. It really was sorry, Honda the old HRV was not good. The new HRV know, much better, it's greatly improved. It has a more powerful engine, it has a nicer interior. It's quieter, like they did lots of things throughout that make this so much better. Like I before I would never have recommended this car to someone looking for this kind of car. Now I would happily recommend it to someone who's like I need to install the CrossOver. Go ahead go look at the HRV it's it's affordable, it drives nicely you can get it with all wheel drive, and it's 100 so you know that it's gonna have good reliability like all these there's really compelling reasons to get this and before it was like an also ran in the compact crossover segment. So I liked it and I like it's affordable. It starts at Oh with front wheel drive 23 650 It tops out on there's only three trims with all wheel drive, it's 28 950 so even the old drive most well equipped version of this thing is still under 30 grand, which is not bad. You know it's not a bad price point. It's easy to drive. I took it this time I took it up to Manchester Vermont so I had a good long drive in it. It was very easy and quiet on the highway and had no issues. It has a nice comfortable interior it has a good amount of room for cargo. It's got the you know the usual infotainment bells and whistles. It has a standard seven inch screen with CarPlay Apple CarPlay and Android Auto but there's a nine inch one that you can get on top trims that has wireless connectivity, which is a nice little bonus. It's basically it's not a flashy, it's not flashy, it doesn't have all fancy upscale stuff in it but it does the job of being an entry level crossover without feeling cheap anymore. It shed the this is a cheap little cart feeling that it had before. So I am I am pleased with this. I drove this at the launch and was really super impressed because they took us we were in Oregon. And they took us in a driveway that had this very twisty turny road up a mountain. And as I looked at this twisty, turny road, I remember thinking, like, really, you're having you think this is gonna make me think positively about your vehicle because it wouldn't have before. This time I took it I'm like, oh, like now I get it because it there is a difference. It does. It does drive so much more nicely than the old one. So I would recommend it now. I like it. Have you guys driven the new curve? Sam Abuelsamid 18:38 Not yet. It's been several years since I drove the old one. And the thing that always struck me about the old one, I actually preferred the design of the old one. Okay, I thought it was a more edge. The new one looks a little bland. Okay, no, I liked the design of the old one. And I liked the packaging of the old one. My My only real complaint about the the original HRV was the powertrain was terrible. It was awful, you know. And, you know, I mean that the HR, the old HRV was based on the Honda Fit platform, and the new ones based on the Civic, which is why it's so much larger than the old. I mean, it's really moved up. I mean, the new HRV is really what the CRV used to be Yeah, and the CRV is also moved up and gotten a lot bigger. So you know, and the old one, you know, especially with all wheel drive, all wheel drive version of the original, it the the 1.8 liter engine that they had in there with the CVT was just a terrible combination with the weight of the all wheel drive. You know, the fit was so much lighter than the HRV that worked a lot better in there but just not not an HRV and so I'm looking forward to trying this one out. Even though like I said, I think it looks a little dull. Nicole Wakelin 19:57 Yeah, that looks thing either like you're just not but you No, it's an offensive. But it's interesting. There's nothing striking you don't look into Google sexy looking crossover. But so it's just kind of it does kind of have milk to styling. It's not super striking. It's not really something that's going to catch your attention. For that I can free like you know the style of cars for sure you're looking for cheap cars. Sometimes you have to like, okay, style aside, do I like driving this does have the features I need and because it have the price that I want, but the driving the old one was just, it was like you said to him, it was awful. It was underpowered, it was loud, it felt like this engine is not going to do what I need it to do like it's going to just like kaput be done before I even get off of this on ramp on the highway. Now, it's a competent little vehicle and we're just taking it the route that I took it through. I had to go from Southern New Hampshire through them in the mountains like mountain range into Vermont, up into Manchester, Vermont. So you're driving some areas where you've got pretty steep hills that you're going up, and even on that oh my god, it's doing it and it's doing it not sounding like the engine is going to explode. You know, and before in the old one, seriously, you had your doubts, you're like, is this gonna break? Is it gonna make it or should I be calling AAA right now like the new one, it's it's good, the powertrain makes such a huge difference. So kudos to Honda for taking the HRV and turning it from a into a good car. I liked it. Though it can attack what the other thing that I drove that was a little bit more off road worthy even. Sam Abuelsamid 21:28 Please tell us about that other things. So Nicole Wakelin 21:31 I also did this thing called the defender trophy edition. Land Rover has this defender they have this trophy competition and you take the defender trophy editions, which I want to say there's 220 units of this available in the United States. And it's at their land rover Experience Center, which is in Manchester, Vermont. And you do A a like competition against Oh God, I want to say it was 14 other teams but I could be wrong on that. So you you have a little competition that's partly physical and partly challenges in your vehicle. And it's I knew both of these things. But the physical part of it, I did not realize that land rover was going to try and drown me. Sam Abuelsamid 22:14 Like, I didn't bring your hip waders with you. Nicole Wakelin 22:16 I did not bring my hip waders next time I went so they have this thing. I think the only picture that I seen a piece you guys knew who ant Anstead is kind of a well known guy, if you go to his Instagram, you'll see a picture of him. And he's on this random floaty thing running across it, I had to run across that thing people and it's like Imagine little float you put in the water the swim to in the summer in your lake. It's really nice. And it's like grounded. But they put this sort of like temporary bridge kind of thing that as you ran across the bridge, it sunk into the water two feet or so. So you had to keep a pretty good pace. Because if you stopped too much you would sink or you could be like me and have absolutely zero coordination and fall and I fell enough times I finally got out there got the key off the little raft. And on the way back, I'm like, I am already soaking wet. So back across it. So I was drenched. So it was it was a bit more physical than I had realized. And you know, 45 degrees, soaking wet jeans, not my favorite. So it was it was a little bit of a challenge. But then we that was just the morning heart where it was like the like hiking and doing that. And it was still super fun because we're all laughing our butts off at each other because it was it was ridiculous. But then we went and then we had all these little competitions, challenges that we had to do in the vehicle. So they were set up in different stages, you had a little map to get to things, you had to do everything from like they kind of made a box, it was like well, sort of like pool noodles. And they made it a giant circle. And you had to go in there and turn around as quickly as you can in this tiny little tight circle. Without popping any of the flags, you had to do it, then your drive partner had to do it. Then you have a thing that had nothing to do with anything you had these wooden, three wooden stakes and, and your flag that you had to make. You had to have a team flag. And then you had rubber bands. And again with the pool noodles, see the water theme going through the whole thing. You had to make a flag and it had to stand for at least 20 seconds and they had to measure how high you got it. And it was really like you had rubber bands, a pool noodle in stakes. So then there was another section that was more like about driving the vehicle. So you had a thing where you had towing in this huge trailer. And you had to see how far you could get going through cones that were like, unless I told all the time, there was not a snowball's chance that I wasn't taken out of the cone on that course. There was like a one where you had to look at a little map. And it was just like, again, we'll steaks and it was you had to, like direct your drive partner through it. But you had to like look at the map for a few minutes and get back to the person in charge. And remember, it was like your memory thing. My memory is only so so I've discovered so I don't know if like that was a challenge. We had when we had really tight turns that you had to navigate get a thing where you use like a high lift jack to do stuff. You had an off road thing where there was mud and there were like navigating really tight corners, you know when you're sort of on steep incline this way and that way you had thing we had to hook up these pulleys to the front of the vehicle and around a tree. And then you had to use the pulleys you couldn't to actually pull the vehicle like, I don't know, maybe like five feet, just on manpower, but you had to hook all the pulleys and the pulleys took the weight, so it was easier. Engineering man, Sam could explain this, it was easier because of the pulleys instead of just like yanking the bumper of the car pushing it. So we had to do that. So is this like combination of little bit of physical challenges with clues to find your keys in the beginning, and then all these off road challenges? It was really fun because the teams were everything from like, there was a Canadian journalists team, there was a couple of outdoor magazine folks. And then a lot of them are just regular old Joe's. They're like, literally people who bought into fender. So they're just regular folks competing in this. So it was this really interesting range of people from around the country who were superduper like fans of their vehicle, which is always fun to have people. Like if you're a superfan for whatever car you have, it's just fun to see that kind of passion, no matter what the vehicle is, whether it's a Hellcat, or whether it's a you know, Land Rover Defender, it's, it's fun to see that, that kind of excitement. So they were really excited about it. And then they did have a competition where there's, there's the winning teams, like eventually move on and they can compete in the UK, which of course the media people weren't part of that but the owner people are part of that. So that was pretty cool. So there's so and they give you you get you know, if you're gonna get cold sweat yellow sweatshirt, you go beanie and a baseball cap and a funky little backpack that I'll see defender trophy. So is a neat thing. So it was part like, like competition part, have fun with your car part, just kind of socializing with people who are as passionate about your vehicle, because you're not going to do something like this. Probably they're gonna buy a one of 220 Defender trophy addition to begin with, if you're not a huge fan of the vehicle, you know, and some of these folks have had a variety of Land Rovers, like forever I go, this is my eighth Land Rover. This is my ninth Well, I've got two in the garage. So it's just it was it was an interesting mix of people and because it was close by for me like some of these I'm in New Hampshire, Vermont, it was like a two hour drive. Some of these people were coming from Atlanta and Texas like they were from far away. So they made quite the trek to come up here to do this. So a fun time was had by all and I didn't catch pneumonia, which is good. So it's all good in the end. But yeah, my I had a lot of wet clothes, I literally came home and I had to fly right back out to an event the next morning. And I have all these wet clothes because I've literally just so my husband wakes up he's like what is happening and there's like socks in jeans and sweatshirts. And like when this all dries out. It all goes in the wash, like, but everything is so cute. I Sam Abuelsamid 27:44 wanted to start in the wash straightaway, Nicole Wakelin 27:46 because I just didn't want to just do a low with just that stuff. I was gonna I just gonna wait and watch a whole bunch of stuff at one time. Like with socks and a shirt and yeah, Roberto Baldwin 27:56 like I need some more clothes and I just start putting clothes on. Sam Abuelsamid 28:00 I know, Land Rover has these has a couple of these Land Rover centers in the US. Do they do the trophy competitions at the other centers as well? Or is it just in Vermont? Nicole Wakelin 28:10 I think in the US. Excuse me in the US the trophy competition is just at the Experience Center in Manchester, Vermont. So if you're in the US you're coming Roberto Baldwin 28:22 if you'd like Vermont, you'd like it ran Land Rover sales, you're like Yeah, makes sense. Yeah, Nicole Wakelin 28:25 I know. It's kind of like as it's like It's spot on. So yeah, so if you're doing that here, you're going to Vermont which is actually also beautiful because it's October so it's fully season so the drive up was gorgeous. So you had all and even just running around there's like weeds everywhere. And it's like oh look at the New England Enos of New England it was it was really cute. So that was fun. So it was an interesting it was a fun challenge. It was fun to see the people people getting really into it and there is a certain camaraderie and although they're like there's people that are hardcore competing because like somebody could go to the UK at the end of this right but there was also a sense of like this is kind of fun to like we're all just having a good time with us. You know, so it was it was cool I enjoyed myself even though I almost died in a lake but I didn't so it's all good. Sam Abuelsamid 29:10 Well, we're glad you didn't die in a lake. Roberto Baldwin 29:13 Like I would have been the Nicole Wakelin 29:14 lady the lake and say would have had swords to throw up people Roberto Baldwin 29:19 you get a sword you Nicole Wakelin 29:21 know I would have done your fender trophies if people Sam Abuelsamid 29:28 all right, well, I had the Ford Expedition Timberline four by four this week in Oxford white and the the expedition got a midcycle refresh this year for the 2020 model year. So basically revised front facia, some, you know, some changes to the tail lights and, and some assorted other minor things. And then the the biggest thing was the addition of this Timberline trim level which we've seen for to add to some of their other SUVs like the Explorer or and I think I think is there I think there might be a Timberline Bronco sport now as well but I can't remember. But basically it's a slightly more off roadie or at least off roadie looking version of the expedition. It does have all terrain tires. It's got some skid plates and stuff and you know it's it's slightly higher than a standard expedition. You know it looks looks looks pretty cool. Personally, you know if I was going to go if I was going to get one of these I would not get an Oxford white I would get it in the they have this lovely green color. Roberto Baldwin 30:40 The green is really nice. I can't believe they sent you white. Yeah, for Sam Abuelsamid 30:43 forest green metallic. Yeah. Yeah, and what the timber line you get some, you get some red accents on the front bumper and the rear bumper and red toe hooks to go with your skid plate so that when you get it stuck in the mud, you can easily hook up a winch or tow strap on there. And then black trim and the grille that wraps around the headlights. So it looks it looks pretty cool. And even in white, it's got a little bit of the Darth Vader or the sort of the Stormtrooper look to it because it's also got black wheels on 18 inch alloy wheels with as I said, with all terrain tires, you know, but basically, you know, other than other than that, you know, it's it's pretty run of the mill expedition, which is the full size, full size three row SUV. You know, it's it's big and roomy. And this is not the XL. There's also a long wheelbase version, although I'm not sure if you can get the the the I don't think you can get the timber line on the max. Yeah, yes, the long wheelbase is the max. So yeah, the timber line only comes on the standard wheelbase version. If you if you want the extended wheelbase version with extra 33rd Row room and cargo space, you've got to get an XL T unlimited or king ranch or platinum. The Timberline starts at $70,705 it also gets the high output 3.5 liter EcoBoost. So I think it's about three to 450 horsepower, which is you know, it's got plenty of grunt, which it needs because this thing is big and fairly hefty. It it's been averaging about 18 miles per gallon. This past several days that I've been driving it, which is better than the Bronco Raptor, but not particularly impressive. Roberto Baldwin 32:43 But But are you willing to pay that extra money because it's about the same price starting price as the Bronco Raptor. And frankly, who needs that many friends that you have to fill up entire? Sam Abuelsamid 32:55 That's true. Yeah. I mean, if if you want something to offer what are you looking for the Bronco Raptor? Roberto Baldwin 33:01 Raptor? Yeah. Or just a regular Bronco, to be honest. Sam Abuelsamid 33:05 That's true. Yeah. Roberto Baldwin 33:07 The manual transmission. Sam Abuelsamid 33:08 The, the the one the one that I've been driving also has the equipment group 501 A, which is a $9,220 package. And for $9,220 What you get is the same 15 and a half inch capacitive touchscreen center touchscreen that you get in the Mustang Mach II. And in the lightning, you get called Ford copilot 360 assist 2.0 which is a slightly more advanced version, it has lane centering instead of just Lane Keeping Assist. So instead of bouncing off the lane markers, it tries to keep you centered in the lane, a 12 speaker b&o sound system, HD radio and a 12 inch digital cluster display. That's what you get for $9,200. Yay. I I would say if you're thinking about Timberline, save the nine grand spend the nine grand on a winch and some good tires. Roberto Baldwin 34:10 Yeah, you go HD Radio? Oh yeah. I only listen to radio and I can't get CarPlay to work. Sam Abuelsamid 34:20 That's about it and why is Roberto Baldwin 34:22 why isn't CarPlay working again? Sam Abuelsamid 34:24 Yeah. And then the other the only other option that was on here was the second row power bench or second row bench powerful tip slide. That basically makes it easier to get into the third row. One of the features I do like on this though, for the third row. It's got power folding third row seats so that there's a couple of buttons in the back you can fold them down, which was handy yesterday when I went to Lowe's to buy a new electric snowblower. Press the button took the seats down. Stick the snowblower in there when I got home Nicole Wakelin 35:00 Press snowblower. Now that means Winter's coming dang it. Sam Abuelsamid 35:04 Yeah, I know. It's coming anyway, whether we like it or not so no. All in the Timberline expedition Timberline came to $79,660 guesses on the destination charge. Oh, Nicole Wakelin 35:26 I have to go under whatever it says. Roberto Baldwin 35:29 Oh, okay. Yeah, we're playing this game now. 1400 Nicole Wakelin 35:35 And then I'm gonna go 13 enterprise. Sam Abuelsamid 35:38 Robbie wins because it was 1695 always Roberto Baldwin 35:41 wins. I think you just tell him I was gonna say 15 102 Sam Abuelsamid 35:46 I'm actually surprised that guy was just driving the Bronco Raptor. This the same destination charge on the Bronco price. He didn't. surprised he didn't go higher than Roberto Baldwin 35:57 I have. Well, my brain works Nicole Wakelin 35:59 for it's gonna say 1495 said had been wrong. Anyway, Sam Abuelsamid 36:02 Ford's been sneaking up on steel lattices delivery charges with that 1700 Because it's the same on the F 150 as well I think now. And so, yeah, they've been they've been creeping up there. So if you're looking for a off roadie ish, full size SUV to haul your your six kids around, and all that stuff. Expedition Timberline is worth a look at Yeah, just pass on the 15 inch screen. You don't really need it. Roberto Baldwin 36:34 If you're if you're a friendless person like myself, just get the Bronco and get the regular Bronco. I'm like, I'm like pricing out a base Bronco with steelies. Like, yeah, we'll Sam Abuelsamid 36:44 get those for about 30 grand. Roberto Baldwin 36:47 Yeah, well, you can you can order one for about 30 grands. Yeah. Sam Abuelsamid 36:53 And then you're gonna spend a ton of money on different wheels and tires and all the accessories and stuff but so you still ended up spending 70 grand on it? No, I do that. Nicole Wakelin 37:02 Just in pieces. Instead of at one time in many, many pieces. You'll spend 70 grand take Roberto Baldwin 37:06 the doors off, you take the roof off. You don't have to spend $70,000 to do that. You can just do that with the regular one. All right. Sam Abuelsamid 37:15 Well, let's, let's talk about the Pole Star Three, which finally got its big reveal this week. Roberto Baldwin 37:21 Pole Star Three looks like a taller pole star. Looks like slightly different nevermind. Sam Abuelsamid 37:28 It's got Thor's hammer headlights or signature. Signature lights. Roberto Baldwin 37:35 It looks cool. I mean, it looks different from everything else that's on the road when it comes to EVs. It looks good. The front at least the front at least. So you got that going for you know, I think they're gonna, you know, pulsars doing really well in here in the Bay Area, because I see them everywhere. Unknown Speaker 37:52 I mean, I've seen a few you have Roberto Baldwin 37:55 a pulsar. We have a pole star dealership in Marin, where all the rich people live. So yeah, that helped. Sam Abuelsamid 38:02 I think there's one in San Jose as well. Roberto Baldwin 38:04 Oh, yeah, there's one. I took photos of that one. I guess you remember things like this. There's also one in San Jose. So you get all the rich tech people and then in rain, you get all just the rich? I don't know. People. Sam Abuelsamid 38:17 Yeah. I think you know, I mean, for for those that haven't seen it yet, the Pole Star Three is a mid size, two row crossover, you know, bigger than the pole star two. Looks like a crossover doesn't look like a a lifted sedan. It's, it's a dual motor standard dual motor configuration with 360 or 380 kilowatts power, if you get the performance pack. And that, that 380 translates to about 510 horsepower, so it's gonna have some, some get up and go, I think Roberto Baldwin 38:57 it'll be like the XC 40. Like you get it. It's so it's far more powerful than you anticipate. I feel like this is gonna be the exact same things with Pollstar three. Yeah, I mean, oh, gosh. Oh, gosh, like the first three days you have this vehicle? Nicole Wakelin 39:12 Probably. I like how it looks. I like this one. Sam Abuelsamid 39:15 Yeah. In, in Europe, it's I think it's rated their plants, dissipating it to be to get about 610 kilometers of range on the W LTP, which is about a little less than 400 miles. And for the US, I think they're anticipating about 300 miles range on EPA. Okay. So it'll be it'll be adequate. It's got lots of Driver Assist features, because this is sharing its same platform with the new Volvo e x 90. Initial production of this is going to happen in China starting middle of next year, and then they're going to add production in South Korea. mine at Volvo Factory in South Carolina, where they're also building the E x 90. It's got 14 and a half inch center touchscreen display and then a smaller instrument cluster display in front of the driver where it belongs. It's, this is going to be the the first of the new Volvo platforms that is powered predominantly by an NVIDIA oran processor, which is a really, really powerful processor for all the Driver Assist stuff and partial automation stuff. It'll be available not initially, but it'll be available slightly after launch with optional LIDAR as part of the pilot pack, so pilot pack is standard. And then a version of that, that adds LIDAR to it will be will be added be available for order from the second quarter of next year. So probably towards the end of the year, we'll be that'll be in production 25 Speaker Bowers and Wilkins audio system. It's it's a pretty slick looking vehicle, I think. Roberto Baldwin 41:09 Yeah, no, I think and it's gonna be built in American, like, the middle of 2024. So if Yeah, hopefully by then the IRA issue with. So you know, 2024, you get that LiDAR, which is, you know, it's, it's, you know, pulsar wants to, they're still, you know, it's still Volvo, they're still Volvo DNA, so they're still always going to be really concerned about safety. And if you're, you know, when it comes down to it, we expected Volvo and CALSTART to have LiDAR, because that's the redundancy. It's a safety issue, and they're gonna put it in there. Sam Abuelsamid 41:44 Yeah, it will have support for 250 kilowatt DC fast charging. It's still a 400 volt electrical architecture, Roberto Baldwin 41:56 which is weird how they must really be pushing it to get to 50. Sam Abuelsamid 41:59 Yeah, I think probably going fairly, fairly high current to get that. What else? 2200 kilo towing capacity. So that's about 46 4700 pound towing capacity. But, you know, keep in mind, this is an Eevee. So you probably don't want to tell too big of a trailer too far. Roberto Baldwin 42:24 Yeah, don't don't try to tell your horses to the next date. You know, what I like about this press release is that it has everything at the very bottom like we sometimes when a new cars is unveiled. We'll get a press release that has like three pieces of key information. And then everything else like oh, we'll tell you later. Like, here's, here's everything. Here's how much it weighs. There's, here's the drag coefficient. Here's the drag force. Here's the charging capacity. Here's the height. Here's a sometimes they want to like, well, what are the dimensions? Oh, we don't have that information now. Like what? Like, do you not know how big your car is? Sam Abuelsamid 43:01 You know, the the GMC Hummer EVs out there? And GM still won't tell us what the they they won't officially say what the battery capacity is. Yeah. Or give us a range that barely talked about the the weight of it? I mean, that's for obvious reasons, I think. Yeah. Yeah, they only highlight a few select specifications, you know, trying to try and find the, all the detailed specs is nearly impossible for especially for GM vehicles these days. Roberto Baldwin 43:30 Yeah, yeah. It's meanwhile Pollstar. Like, here you go. There's everything. Hey, even put the performance pack price. Little thing or it's easy to find, I guess. 6600 euros? Yeah, sure. It'll be different in the Sam Abuelsamid 43:44 slot. Yeah, the starting price in Europe is at $9,900. In the US, it's going to be at $3,500. And they're, I think they've started taking pre orders this week. So you can if you're interested in one of these, you can go ahead and get your order in. And you'll start, they'll start to deliver them sometime in the second half of 2023. Roberto Baldwin 44:09 You know, it's cool. If you're rich and you can afford this car. There's not going to be a dealer markup. Sam Abuelsamid 44:15 Right? That's true. Yeah, because they're doing direct sales. They're not doing they're not going through through standard dealers. Nicole Wakelin 44:21 So I'm gonna see if we even had one we do have a pole star in Boston on fancy fancy Street in Boston, so I could like I'm not one of the fancier areas of Boston and like, Roberto Baldwin 44:32 a one to three fancy fancy, fancy pants lane. No, but I wasn't Nicole Wakelin 44:36 even sure I'm like I think I've seen like two pole stars in driving around on the roads here. And I thought we do even have a dealership anywhere that people get ordered that a dealership a showroom. We didn't have one in Boston, so Sam Abuelsamid 44:48 yeah. Cool. All right. Next up, another new Eevee that's coming but not until 2026 and six Yeah, so this is, Honda made some news this week, actually made a couple of bits of news. But the first thing, earlier this year, they announced that they were going to form a joint venture with Sony. And we've seen the 2020 and 2022. Ces shows, Sony showed a couple of Eevee concepts. And, you know, kind of hinted that they'd like to get into, into vehicles. And then in I think, in March or April of this year, they announced an agreement with Honda to form a joint venture called Sony Honda mobility. And this week, they revealed that they're moving forward with that, and production of the first vehicles is going to start in 2026. In Ohio, the consent pill on us on EVs in Ohio, and Honda's responsible for the vehicle engineering. And this is the part that kind of makes me a little nervous is Sony is responsible for the software platform. Sony's not got a great history with I mean, Sony is also going to be supplying a lot of components, you know, a lot of sensors, cameras, sensors, various other sensors, a variety of other, you know, electrical electronic components, but they're doing the software, which Sony, Roberto Baldwin 46:23 okay, so I have a PlayStation I like three, I I'm not a gamer, so I just stopped playing, the only thing I have that's new is a switch. And using the software to like navigate to things on PlayStation three is just ridiculous. I also have a Sony camera, a 6100, which is a wonderful camera, except you'd like using the software like oh my god, this again. They make these like really great pieces of hardware. And then they have like, well, I don't know, someone came up, Bill over in accounting came up with a software idea. Nicole Wakelin 46:54 Build accounting had this idea. And we're like, you know what? Roberto Baldwin 46:57 It's built time to shine or not? Sam Abuelsamid 47:04 Yeah, so that's, that's got me a little nervous about how that's that's all going to work out. We'll see. I mean, maybe they'll finally get their act together. You know, I've got a PlayStation four. I've used some Sony cameras in the past. I've also read reviews of Sony smartphones. And the big complaint with their phones, you know, again, like like with their cameras, great hardware, terrible software. So you know, with vehicles moving towards this kind of software defined vehicle approach. Roberto Baldwin 47:38 We'll see here, the hardware, the hardware, the software is hard to use, but it works. Nicole Wakelin 47:45 Okay, so Roberto Baldwin 47:47 So, so when we Sam Abuelsamid 47:49 want something crashing all the time, where do you when it's easy, or Roberto Baldwin 47:55 that works, it's solid, but it's like good luck finding how to like adjust the seat here. Sam Abuelsamid 48:02 Oh, no tough choice. But then the other thing that I'm back to Roberto Baldwin 48:09 Yes, bring back the SB 2000 ad as an Eevee. And I don't care what the software is, I'm not even gonna, I'm not gonna turn it on. I'm just gonna turn off the infotainment system and drive my my STI is an Eevee. Yeah, Sam Abuelsamid 48:20 you go. The other things Honda announced this week is the establishment of an Eevee hub in Ohio. They've got a bunch of plants in central Ohio, in the vicinity of Columbus and Marysville, where, where they've got their US r&d headquarters in Marysville. They've got a couple of assembly plants in Marysville and East liberty, Ohio, and a powertrain plant in an Ohio and they're going to be spending $700 million dollars to retool Lowe's to build EVs and Evie components. And are also announced that in Fayette County, Ohio about 40 miles from Columbus, the previously announced joint venture that we're doing with LG for batteries is going to build a three and a half billion dollar battery plant with 40 gigawatt hours of annual capacity. And all of that is also going to be ready for 2026 And you know, maybe, you know maybe that's what you know that stuff will be going into the Honda Sony, Evie, or is it Sony Honda? I think it's Sony Honda's Nicole Wakelin 49:32 me Honda who gets put their name first. Yeah, Roberto Baldwin 49:35 it should be Honda Sony's I mean if you're buying a car I don't I rather have Honda in front of the name. You know, you're right. Nicole Wakelin 49:40 Because Because then you think it's a Honda that just has so many stuff. Otherwise, you're like, it's a Sony car at 100 Just put in their two cents Sam Abuelsamid 49:47 on it. I'm just building it for us. So yeah, Honda, Honda and Sony, you know, so after after Honda introduces a couple of GM Bill TVs in 2024. They're going to start building their own stuff in two years later 2026 And some of it will be with Sony and some might be on their own we'll see Roberto Baldwin 50:09 II architecture which is a Honda everything Honda and accurate names is just the thing what it does for handling all wheel drive. Well, how's it handled super? Alright. Great sounds the architecture it's an it's an E architecture. Oh, okay. No fancy, there's like, this is what it is Sam Abuelsamid 50:31 very straightforward. Very much unlike Electrify America been doing some weird things with branding lately. A few weeks back, they announced that they're going to be putting new stickers on their chargers. labeling them as hyper fast and ultra fast. What and even mean, hyper is Roberto Baldwin 50:54 350 Ultra is like 150 Yeah, but you have to like know that one is faster than the other. So it's gonna I still can't remember which is which? Sam Abuelsamid 51:03 Yeah, I actually had a conversation with some folks from Electrify America a couple of days ago. After I because they they had sent out they had posted a tweet about their charging station. Cabazon, California, which is now back online. It's been upgraded. And the the text of the tweet that goes along with the picture, this location features to balanced 350 kilowatt hyperfast chargers, and one dedicated 350 kilowatt hyperfast charger. And I sent a note to to somebody at Electrify America and said, What does this even mean? Yeah, it's, you know, between balance 350 kilowatt and dedicated 350 kilowatt and Ultra and hyper. You know, and on top of all this, everybody's complaining about unreliability of Electrify America chargers, you know, it's like, why are you wasting time on this labeling? You know, instead of fixing the real problem, and it turns out, after the conversation, that they actually are working on the on the, the more fundamental problem of reliability. You know, I'm still not crazy, but the branding turns out that the balanced 350 kilowatt chargers are designed to support two vehicles charging simultaneously, and it can split it, you know, 175 kilowatts each, whereas the, the dedicated the dedicated is for a single vehicle charging at 350 kilowatts. Okay, but Roberto Baldwin 52:41 how do you explain that to the regular person when they go up to 350 charts? There's your issue is the same thing with with with with Tesla, I would go to a Tesla charging station, or in the early days, and then it would be like, Oh, I'm only getting seven kilowatt because there's 12 other people here. And like, Okay, I understand that, but I see people in their other Tesla's just like getting frustrated, like, unplugging. replugging looking at the same happening. Yeah, they don't understand why am I only getting this amount of electricity. I'm like, it's like a fire. It's like a hose. I Sam Abuelsamid 53:09 got six chargers and only 200 kilowatts of because it's Nicole Wakelin 53:12 just like getting used to charge like, you go to a gas station, you get gas and 99% of the time you get gas at the same rate coming into your car, you don't notice a significant difference because everyone's pumping gas at Sam Abuelsamid 53:22 once. And there's no if there's one person pumping gas or 12, people pumping gas, everybody's still getting gas at the same Nicole Wakelin 53:28 rate. So you meet so there's this like intuitive like, well, that's how fueling a vehicle works, whether it's electricity or gas, and unfortunately, it's not. Sam Abuelsamid 53:37 So the other thing that I learned from EA from my conversation the other day, we talked about the reliability problems they've been having. And last year, and the first sometime in 2021. I remember John Volker was writing a lot about problems that he was seeing in the northeast, he lives in the New York area. And he was writing about problems he was seeing with a lot of the EAA chargers in the Northeast. And turns out when EA first started building out their network a few years ago, and one of the things, one of the first decision was, they weren't going to even going to bother with 50 kilowatt chargers, which is most of what the DC fast chargers were at that point, they're just gonna go straight to 150 and 350. Because they knew that going forward, you know, that's what all the vehicles were going to support. But they, you know, they also they, to get their network built out quickly. They worked with four, four different suppliers of charging equipment. And not all of them had the same level of quality and reliability, let's say, and, you know, there is your supplier. Exactly. And so the supplier, most of the chargers in the Northeast region. That one was the, you know, they had a lot of problems with that one. And so they made the decision to rip out and replace all those chargers. ers. And that should be better. I don't know. I mean, I'm still seeing John and others in the Northeast complaining about problems with the Chargers. But those, those have all been replaced with a different supplier. But now, another of the suppliers they've been having problems with this year, including the one that's down the road from me here. And so what they actually decided to do last year, after they started doing the rip and replace on that first batch of chargers, is instead of continuing to work with a lot of off the shelf stuff, they were going to start getting purpose built stuff to their specifications, to that has better software and better diagnostics capabilities. So they can reach in and find out what's wrong getting, you know, can figure out, you know, if people are having problems with those chargers, and you know, be able to get somebody out to fix them, and they're easier to repair, if necessary. And so they've got a new generation of purpose built chargers. And I think that's what's actually in this, this charging station in California, where they had the, the thing about the balanced hyperfast chargers and the dedicated chargers is actually this new generation of chargers that they're installing. And that's actually and by the by this, they told me that by the end of this year, they're going to have over 50 of their stations, over 50 of their locations are going to be ripping out this the second supplier and replacing them with these new generation chargers that are designed to last, you know and operate, hopefully reliably for at least eight to 10 years. Roberto Baldwin 56:46 We we both did that. croute. You know, we both did that cruise, the GM cruise event where they walked us through and they told us all this stuff about how they're doing it. And I just the suppliers just aren't ready for you for electrification is what it comes down to these big giant bulky things that don't quite work, right. And everyone's just having to build their own thing. I think it's what happens with, you know, what's your like you're saying, he is realizing like, oh, all the people that we usually use for cars, or for you know, all these are just aren't ready. And so we have to build our own, or at least we have to design our own and make them build it. And I think that's what's what everyone's sort of figuring out. And hopefully the suppliers will figure it out soon, that they're like, oh, we gotta be better. We can't just be like, Hey, we have some stuff. Nicole Wakelin 57:29 I mean, I'm stuff. Sam Abuelsamid 57:30 The The other thing that they're changing is their whole back end software stack that manages you know, authentication and payments and everything else. They again, they had used something off the shelf that was available from a vendor to start with, they've built up, they're an entirely new stack with a lot more capability in it. And they've actually, apparently, that deployed that already now like within the last few weeks, they've switched over to their, their in house built software stack for managing everything. So we'll we'll keep an eye on EA over the next, you know, 612 months, eventually they're going to replace all of their chargers with these new generation chargers. Roberto Baldwin 58:16 Totally different to Yeah, chargers. Sam Abuelsamid 58:18 Right. So hopefully, hopefully, there'll be better. We'll see. We'll let you know or, you know, if you run across one of these new chargers, you know, the current AAA chargers, you know, they're these white pedestals with a big hole on the top with green trim on them. And the new ones, look, they're still predominantly white. But if you happen to encounter one of these new charges, let us know if you you know how it goes. You know if it's any better or worse, because hopefully, hopefully it'll get better. We'll see it better. It better improve because it's getting a lot more down the road. Yeah, Roberto Baldwin 58:57 I was fortunate with my drive with the BMW for a few weeks ago when they were doing all the upgrades so I was getting free charging. I was like Yeah, but I'm one of the charges I charged the screen just didn't work but it was still charging Am I good enough. Sam Abuelsamid 59:15 But things I mentioned was the screens you know, not being readable and a lot of conditions. Roberto Baldwin 59:21 Yeah, it was it just felt like ham fisted thrown together. Like a Frankenstein this Las Vegas they just updated Las Vegas one I've charged this Las Vegas station a bunch so Oh, look, they have the written 350 Right on the road. Right in the parking space. Sam Abuelsamid 59:36 Oh, so you don't have to read the label. Yeah. Oh, yeah, that's nice. Yeah. Roberto Baldwin 59:44 350 To 350 Oh, see, that's there you go. That's the smart thing I was when I was charging in the mountains. There were some non ego charge point chargers. And at the top of the charger, there was like, like, like a display that said, Yeah, Pool unavailable and like what? And you could see it from across the lawn, Nicole Wakelin 1:00:04 you know, right away before you get all the way over there. You don't drive all Roberto Baldwin 1:00:07 the way over there like, oh, this, someone's on this one. And you mean, if you're doing a road trip, you're like, Well, I guess I just hang out or find another one. But if you're, you know, just around town, you're like, oh, I'll just park over here, then I look for those charging stations, and I'm driving around town. I'm like, Yeah, I'm gonna get some free charging, or I'm gonna get some charging while I'm here. But if it's. But if it's full, I'm like, I drove all the way up there, like, I could have parked somewhere else. Sam Abuelsamid 1:00:33 All right. Last story we've got for this week is Toyota, moving away from Amazon. Toyota was one of the first automakers to really embrace integrating Amazon Alexa voice services into its vehicles. But now they're moving away. In fact, this week earlier this week while I was in Nashville to drive a new drive some new Toyota vehicles, when the press release came out. And I had a chance to talk with one of the Toyota engineers about what's what's going on with that. And basically, you know, there's no over the air software update involved with this. It's all in the backend. Newer the vehicles that have the new Toyota infotainment system that debuted on the tundra last year, is now on a whole bunch of Toyota and Lexus vehicles. They, the voice recognition system that's in there is a hybrid system that it has some stuff that's embedded in the vehicle for when you don't have connectivity. But when you do have a connection, it's, you know, whatever commands you give it, it sends those up to the cloud processes them, and then executes on that. And until now, they've been using Amazon, Alexa voice services to power that. And this week, they switched over to using Google Cloud AI to do that voice recognition. And they told me, they explained to me that the the, using Google Cloud AI, gave them much more capability with the voice recognition, it does much better job of natural language. It's got because it's tied into Google search and, and other stuff that you can find all the points of interest and things like that that a lot more, it's a lot more robust than what's available from Amazon. Have you guys tried using the Amazon stuff in any of the vehicles, whether it's Toyota or GM? Or like, Roberto Baldwin 1:02:39 oh, you need to sign in? I'm like, oh, like, Nicole Wakelin 1:02:42 I don't think just because I don't know what to be bothered signing in what you're saying, like I don't want to do, Roberto Baldwin 1:02:48 which is like, really, I have to sign in just to use this. This is ridiculous. Like, if you get in a pole star, and you don't want to sign into Google, you don't have to, I don't have to sign into Google. I can be you know, I don't have to have my stuff. You know, if I if I get into another? You know, if I get into a Mercedes, I don't have to sign into NBU to mbux. Voices. Yeah, the signing anything is just, it's a drag. Nicole Wakelin 1:03:10 It's a pain. Yeah, I'm anti having to sign into things out. Oh, have you played with a Sam, Sam Abuelsamid 1:03:18 I have tried it out a few times. You know, and it's, you know, it's okay. It does a, an okay, job of the voice recognition part of it. But yeah, I mean, it. Right, you know, it's only tied into, you know, into Amazon's map Point of Interest database, which is not as, as robust, robust and feature feature filled as what Google's got in Google Maps, you know, for music, you know, it'll play stuff from Amazon music, which, if you use Amazon music, is fine. But, you know, the Google stuff can tie into YouTube music, or Spotify, or anything else, the way the way it's set up, it can, it can do a lot more stuff with it. And, you know, obviously, you know, if you've got concerns about, you know, using Google for privacy purposes, you don't actually have to sign in to it. You can each say, hey, Toyota, and give it the command and it'll, it just does the, the processing and, and then it's sends it back to the car. And it's all tied in. It's tied into a bunch of vehicle functions. So you can do things like change the cabin temperature and change the volume, and so on without actually touching anything. Yeah, I Roberto Baldwin 1:04:40 mean, you can't say like, drive me home, because it doesn't know what your home is because you haven't signed yet, which is fine. Yeah, so you're dressed. Sam Abuelsamid 1:04:49 Alright, well, let's answer some listener questions. Okay. First up, Andrew Pappas asks, Will we see a new ES based on the new Toyota crown? Nicole Wakelin 1:05:01 See an ESB? Sam Abuelsamid 1:05:02 So Alexa CS, which, up until now has always been based on the Camry. Do you think the ES will switch over to the Crown platform? Nicole Wakelin 1:05:10 No, I don't think so. What do you think? I don't? I don't know, I guess it could. Roberto Baldwin 1:05:17 I was driving around one day and I was behind a camera and an IES like, it was exactly the same. I was like, Oh, I'm so I hope this person like Nicole Wakelin 1:05:28 how much do they spend on this experience? Roberto Baldwin 1:05:30 Yeah, how much more Did you spend for the you know, for the track, different for the trackpad? Maybe Sam Abuelsamid 1:05:42 I can see them actually shifting the IES to the Crown platform. Because, you know, for the for the same reasons, you know, the crown, if you haven't seen it yet, and we'll be talking about it more next time. After the embargo lifts. But the you know, the crown is a sedan that is a high riding sedan. So it's got sort of a crossover ish stance to it, like four inches taller than an Avalon. But, interestingly enough, it only has an extra half inch of ground clearance. So anyway, that, you know, part of the reason for that is that they say that, you know, more and more people, you know, something, there's a lot of people who like the the higher hip point of a crossover, the higher seating position of a crossover, but don't necessarily want a crossover shaped vehicle. They still like the idea of a sedan. And given that, you know, Lexus probably has a little bit older demographic, especially for something like the ES than the than Toyota does. I wouldn't be surprised if they actually shift the the Next Gen II s to the Crown platform and have that similar kind of high riding sedan form factor. Roberto Baldwin 1:07:01 So is that the wheel? I mean, who cares about the what do you call it? Clearance? The will clearance clearance? Because yeah, but is the is it? Is it easier to get in and out of? Is it higher? Sam Abuelsamid 1:07:14 Yeah, you sit a little bit higher, so you're not dropping down into the car as much. Roberto Baldwin 1:07:18 Okay, yeah. So ya know, that in that case, that makes a lot of sense. Because, you know, it's tough when, you know, as you get older getting in and out of lower cars, Nicole Wakelin 1:07:28 I can see it being a nice thing for you know, like you said, as you're older, I think that's kind of nice, actually, you know, makes it easier for you. Roberto Baldwin 1:07:36 Just like, oh, this thing just slides straight in and slides straight out. That's, that's, that's, that's what you want. If you're older, and you're like, Oh my God, if get in and out of the vehicle you're shopping for see how see how it feels getting in and out. Because you can just slide right into slide right out, you're gonna be so much happier in the long term. Sam Abuelsamid 1:07:56 All right. Adam J asks, How do you feel about extended warranties, have a Maki and plan to keep it past the three year warranty expiration but worry about how much expensive tech is in new cars nowadays? Even my doors have actuators in them? Would you would never have considered a warranty 15 years ago, but now what do you think? Would you would you spend the money on an extended warranty? Roberto Baldwin 1:08:20 No. I well see this. Here's the thing is I'm a handy guy. So I'll just fix things after the warranty goes out. If you're not a handy person. Especially how long Nicole Wakelin 1:08:32 did they say they're keeping the car for wait to get it Sam Abuelsamid 1:08:34 just got beyond the three year warranty? Roberto Baldwin 1:08:37 On the three year warranty? Nicole Wakelin 1:08:38 I mean, how how often do you have I mean, realistically versus what you pay for the warranty? How often do you have Strophic meltdowns after just after a year? Right. Like like when you think about what i Roberto Baldwin 1:08:51 The biggest problem is the battery and the battery is like, what, eight years? 10 Sam Abuelsamid 1:08:54 years? Yeah. miles on the battery. Exactly. So Roberto Baldwin 1:08:59 Wow. I mean, I probably wouldn't do it. I mean, if you're rich and you're just like I don't want to ever think about Nicole Wakelin 1:09:05 I don't know what to do. Even if you're rich. You just go buy a car all this broke. Well, good. That's true. Yeah. Roberto Baldwin 1:09:12 Go ahead. No, I don't know what I was gonna say the thing. Sam Abuelsamid 1:09:15 The thing about extended warranties is they generally don't come from the manufacturer, they usually provided by third party. And you need if you're gonna, if you're thinking about an extended warranty, you need to really read through it in detail, because there's usually a lot of caveats, a lot of deductibles. I've never bothered with an extended warranty except for one time one time we got an extended warranty for a couple of years on a VW that we had, and it turned out to be a complete waste of money because when we actually needed to use it, it the problem was not even covered under the warranty. So there's there's a lot of there tends to be a lot of fine print and extended warranties. And they're usually a very high profit margin thing for dealers and the companies that sell the warranties. You know, the dealers get a cut of whatever you pay for that warranty. And, and the companies that sell these warranties usually do their best to make sure that they don't actually have to cover anything under the warranty. So I, you know, take a look at whatever is available. And, you know, make sure you read it in detail. Maybe even have a lawyer look at it, you know, or somebody that knows contract law. Because there's a good chance it probably won't actually be that useful to you. Roberto Baldwin 1:10:42 Fight. Okay, so either a you have a friend who's a lawyer or B have a friend that's handy. Sam Abuelsamid 1:10:46 Yes. Yeah. Preferably the latter. Yeah. Roberto Baldwin 1:10:50 Sue is like super handy things just like hey, Sue, there's something weird going on with the door. Can you come look at it and then feed su tacos? Aaron go. I worked on my cousin's car last weekend for tacos. Nicole Wakelin 1:11:05 Or whatever your family like for tacos or pizza or any of those? Roberto Baldwin 1:11:09 Yeah, I have a large Mexican family. So I got tacos and then a bunch of like, other Mexican type thing. That like she's sent me on with I'm like, yes. Sam Abuelsamid 1:11:20 All right. Ford recently AJs Ford recently announced a blue cruise 1.2 for the 2023 model year that will mimic super cruisers ability for lane changes, any chance to 21 and 22 models. We'll get it eventually. I hope the current models are not missing some crucial hardware. No, there is no hardware change. It's just a software update. You will get blue cruise 1.2 on on your 21 and 22 Mustangs, Maki's and F 150 lightnings. And or f f 150s. In general, and anything else that had its that's gonna be available first, you know, from the factory on the 23 model year, Maki's and Lincoln Corsair. But it will over the next several months, it will get out to all of the other vehicles that have blue cruise or Lincoln's active plot. In addition to the lane change on demand, when you tap the turn signal, it will also support proactive speed control, which supercruise has had since 2017. Which, as you're driving down the road, it will look at curves, look at the map and look at curves in the road. And if your speed is a little bit too high to safely go through the curve, it might drop your speed down a few miles an hour as you go through the curve and then resume your previous set speed. And just general improvements in the control of the system. So yeah, all the all the hardware is exactly the same. So no, no hardware updates required. And you'll you'll get it either as an OTA or if you want it sooner you can take it into dealer and have them flat reflash the software for you. Roberto Baldwin 1:13:01 So yeah, we get it. Sam Abuelsamid 1:13:03 Yep. Dan Basma. We hear a lot about us and Asian brands, developing autonomous technologies. Is there any reason that European vendors appear to be failed, fallen flailing falling around? Nicole Wakelin 1:13:16 Think it should be flailing, flailing, Roberto Baldwin 1:13:20 playing around? I have been in the Drive Pilot, which is level three for Mercedes. Much times at this point, they will likely have the first level three system in the United States will be Mercedes the s and then eventually on the last class and eventually the EQs as well. I don't necessarily feel like they're flailing. Yeah, they're not falling behind. I think they're they're there. There's a lot of rules and regulatory issues in the the EU, which are actually good, because the regulatory setup is for the entire EU, like, these are the rules and they're like, oh, okay, cool. Whereas the United States, it's like, these are the rules, and every county and every state and every city and everything. So it's a little bit tougher for them. So yeah, so I mean, so yeah, so the, you know, the Volkswagen Group had Audi Audi had a level three thing that they just decided to sort of not do because of regulatory issues. But yeah, they're not they're not falling behind. They're just I think they're being a bit more cautious and a little less like hey, look at us about it. I think they're they're they're they're very it's it's like Daimler and electric semis that you can buy an E Cascadia electric semis right now. Yeah, drive it around. Yeah, but they're just that they're, you know, they don't I just don't like buying into the hype that I guess Tesla was like, we got a semi It's electric. And it was like yeah, meanwhile, there's like Daimler Trucks that you can buy right now. They're Sam Abuelsamid 1:14:46 electric and Volvo Trucks Volvo Volvo. Yeah, I Roberto Baldwin 1:14:49 drove. I drove a Volvo truck in Sweden, you know, a big panel truck around electric. And then again, it's tweeted Sweden. This To be Swedish, it's a kind of it's a cultural thing where they just don't brag. Yeah, no one. They're just like, hey, we have a car. If you like it, it's cool. If you don't we understand. Nicole Wakelin 1:15:10 Okay, that's fine. We're okay with that. Yeah, so Roberto Baldwin 1:15:13 Europeans, Europeans are doing are on par are actually doing better than the sum of US and Japanese automakers, Sam Abuelsamid 1:15:22 at least, you know, when it comes to consumer level technologies, you know, things like Robo taxis, you know, the real, you know, high level automated stuff, you know, Volkswagen Group, you know, owns an equal stake with Ford in Argo AI. And they, you know, they've got a fleet running around Europe testing now with with a fleet of ID buses with the Argo driver system on there. That is testing in Hanover and Munich, right now. And they're also developing consumer grade stuff as well, that'll be coming to various vehicles in the next several years. So and Volvo, you know, has been doing a lot of work in this area, BMW has been been doing some stuff, BMW has had some challenges. You know, they initially had a partnership with with Mercedes Benz to do level three and level four, which then got dropped. And then they formed a partnership with Mobileye, to do the same thing. We'll see if that ever comes to fruition. And then, finally, most recently, they they formed a partnership with Qualcomm to develop a system level level three and level four technologies for their 2023 or 2025, noi, class EVs. And we'll see if that one actually gets anywhere. But you know, they've all been working on this stuff. You know, but based on the the number of automated vehicles you can buy from any other manufacturer, like you said, I don't know that they're actually behind. Roberto Baldwin 1:17:03 Yeah, yeah. I just remembered I went to a big event, a big BMW event where they were opening the building for their autonomous like, program. And they were drummers Sam Abuelsamid 1:17:15 was that with the Mercedes partnership, or, or was that Roberto Baldwin 1:17:21 it must have been Mercedes it was it was way before COVID. It was a long time ago. It was years ago. And then they had his ride around, Aegis, they had just right around autonomous car in a parking lot, which was like Sam Abuelsamid 1:17:37 Dan vestment also asks, that metallic noise coming from the back of my car's probably nothing to worry about, right? Roberto Baldwin 1:17:45 So if there was Metallica coming from the back of your car, I wouldn't be cool turned the metallic noise. Maybe your differential, probably check that. Sam Abuelsamid 1:17:56 dragging along the Roberto Baldwin 1:17:57 robia brake could be could be an issue with you maybe haven't changed. Or if you have pads in the pack or your drum. There's, there's a lot of there's a lot of metal in cars. And whenever you hear that metal likes grinding together, that's not a good. So you should definitely what you're saying Sam Abuelsamid 1:18:12 is it's fine, right? Yeah, it's fine. Roberto Baldwin 1:18:15 It's fine. If it's just Metallica, if it's Metallica, you're good? Sam Abuelsamid 1:18:19 Yeah. Okay. And then Gareth Thomas, says, I'm hoping you can do me a favor, my dad ordered an E Transit last October, the dealer said it would take 60 days, it's been a year, there's been no communication from anyone for this whole time, aside from an email a couple of weeks ago, saying there have been delays. You know, more hurt people involved. So I'm hoping you could do a little poking around and see if there's anything more to know. So what I would say, you know, there's a couple of things that could be going on here. First of all, you know, if, if your dad actually placed an order a factory order with the dealer, and you know, has has a purchase contract for any transit, then that should be with Ford, you know, certainly, E Transit deliveries have been relatively slow. Still, they didn't start until I think, March or April of this year. And I think they've been delivering about four or 500 a month. So they're not, they're not really cranking them out just yet. And in part, you know, I think part of the reason for that is that the transit is built with the same battery modules and the same rear motor that's used in the maki and Ford's been trying to ramp up production of the machi. So there may be some shortages of components and may not be able to build as many transits as they would like yet. All that, you know, production is being ramped up. So hopefully, you know, that may be part of the problem. If all if your dad did nothing But, you know, go to the dealer and say, you know, here's the deposit, you know, or, or even if they gave them a deposit and just said, you know, I want an E Transit when you get one, then that's, that's a different situation, then yeah, you're relying on the dealer, having both ordered one and got an allocation of any transit. If, you know, so if you've got, you know, a factory order in, then that's it, then it's in Ford's hands to build it. But if it's just saying, you know, I was telling your dealer, I want the first transit that comes in, and the dealer hasn't necessarily gotten allocation of E Transit, then there's not much that can be done, you so need to make sure you actually have a real order. And if you do have an order, and then the next step would be to call for customer service, you know, kind of bypass the dealer, and there is a customer service number, which it's an 800 number, which I'll put in the show notes, but it's 1-800-392-3673. Or you can just Google for customer service. And that will get you through directly to Ford. And you can find out, you know, has your order actually been processed? You know, kind of what's, what stages of that they can help you out? And if not, if it hasn't been sent in by the dealer, and they're just waiting for one to show up, then you need to actually make sure you get one officially ordered. Roberto Baldwin 1:21:33 Yeah, yeah. A year. That's, I mean, that's the crazy world we're in where automakers are deciding, well, do we want to sell some more transit? Or do we want to sell more monkeys? Or do we want to Nicole Wakelin 1:21:48 sell? Yeah, everything is so it's, you know, it's you want to kind of get upset with the OEM and be like, I should have it by now. But things are still really messed up for the pandemic and nothing is coming in the way that you expect. Sometimes it takes a couple of months. Sometimes it takes more than a couple of months. Roberto Baldwin 1:22:06 I did like that transit though, and I drove it. That was a fun Yeah. Sam Abuelsamid 1:22:10 Transits good van and you know, and electric versions bound to be even better. Roberto Baldwin 1:22:14 Yeah, no, it's it's a fun car to drive. Or van. Car. Yeah. It's fantastic. Sorry. Oh, Lord. Sam Abuelsamid 1:22:24 All right. Well, that's all we've got for this week. Thank you, everybody, for listening, and we'll talk to you next time. Bye.